randall page I would say you are on the right track. I have herd of people doing this with Poor traits and wounder why it doesn't work. Thinking their hounds will get better, I just doesn't work that way, with everything I have read and studed You have to start out with somthing you can live with. The key is when you do outcross is to bring in something that you want. Evaluating the outcross that you did, which means putting the pups into capable hands that know how to evaluate or keep the pups yourself.

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after reading many opinons from many differant genetic experts over the years and breeding my own dogs,this is the way i have come to understand the whole deal.

alot of people say that thier "inbred" dogs were idiots. its because one or some of the dogs in thier bloodline were idiots too and passed it down. its got nothing to do with how they were related.
there are many untrainable idiots out of dogs that have no family relationship too. and they are idiots for the same reason the close related dogs were.

ALL pure bred dogs are inbred. thats how they became pure bred. thats how you get specific traits to establish a breed of dog.
anytime you breed 2 dogs of the same breed you are inbreeding. breeding with"in" a breed.

LINEBREEDING is a term to describe breeding one specific line or strain of a breed. done to keep the traits of that line.
linebreeding works to keep desired traits, but only if all the dogs in the line that are bred down, have the same desired traits you want to keep.the same desired traits that the original dog or bloodline of dogs they are bred down from had. the sole reason dogs are linebred is for desired traits.

a so called OUTCROSS is still inbreeding, the only time the term is used correctly is in linebreeding. you breed in traits you want in your line or faults out of your line by going "out" of your line to another line of dogs of the same breed..dogs that have the traits you want in your line or dont have the faults you have in your line...

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RED EAGLE MACK & RED EAGLE STYLISH BOOMER
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Randy Raper

sarge, i just read your ped on your dog there.
i hunted with coz sparetime spanky a whole bunch in the nite hunts.
in the early to mid 90's.

Well said Toe cutter better than I did. coz sparetime spanky Is in Russ Downings breeding, I just used it as an example because they have done it for so long. How did you like that hound??? I am looking down the road and was thinking about doing a cross. Everyone I have talked with says they are pretty good layup hounds. I know they do well in the UKC events.

i aint got a clue on what traits are left in there that he had. spanky was a close hunting dog. the game was to keep his handler from walking him in. you get him up in the woods he was a pretty nice little dog.
if i remember right there was not much boo color in spanky. more of a whitetick.
thats what stood out to me, the no boo in spanky, in color or track. he could move a track more like a walker.
first few times i drew him i thought he was a blue english dog.
i thought it was dave dean that owned spanky.
jerry wynn was his handler everytime i drew him.

Russ may have just had offsping from that hound. I don't know, you just see allot of it in his breeding. From the way you say BOO I take it you have been behind some blueticks that wern't worth a darn. I can't say what you have saw, I know I like reading what you say. But lets just say we are both houndmen with different experiances. Mine is with mostly Big game from 1973-79. It was with my father that ran 10-15 walkers except one. Old Blue, on bad tracks we droped him out to get the track hot enough for the walkers. But you will never here me say a bad word about a walker because I believe I was behind two of the best Big game walkers that ever lived. Luke and Chuck with old blue, I have seen to many walkers that Babble in the hunts. You never saw that in my fathers hounds. If they opened they were on it. Like I said I like what you write because it makes sence, sorry you have seen Sorry Blues. Coons are easy, leave a sent trail any hound can run and plentiful not a messuring stick of a hound JMO. But I love it and that is what I do now LOL!!! Just talking with anouther houndman What makes me smile is when I am running with a hound I know isn't a me too hound but is a realy GOOD hound and can't smell what my hound has in the tree. That's the only way I know I am on the right track where I want to be. May not be track stars that blow trough the country. but I get the filling Old blue is there. Everyone has in their mind what they want in a hound.

i only used the bootick term becuase i knew you would know exactly what i was talking about. mr norh-mntb&t turned me on to that term.
i have seen some mighty fine blueticks and i have seen some sorry walkers too.
i like a tight mouthed dog, cant stand a babblin dog or a loose mouthed dog. i like a dog that can run a hot track to catch it ,but be able to slow up and drift or even get down and straddle a old cold track and grub it up.or just fall treed on a layup like they have been treed there before. nothing wrong with a dog with a cold nose if he has the track sense (brains) to use it. all my young dogs off mack go through the same phase of thinking if they can smell coon at all- they can find the coon.,they think they can move any track they find..and after they have learned the track sense they need to do it they can. they start hunting when you turn them loose, they aint blowing past any. hot or cold they take them as they find them and adjust to do what they have to do to work it and find the coon. when one of my friends tells me the coon aint movin. i tell them the coon dont have to be movin,they just got to be alive. partly i'm just being a smart azzz,but i actually do believe it too.
some dont know that blueticks,english and walker dogs were the same breed at one time. this line of walkers still has the best traits of all 3 types still in thier tool box.main reason i have stayed with it for over 30 yrs now.
but i have owned some real good blueticks,red bones and black and tans too.
its not the color breed i stay with,its the traits of this line.they just happen to be walkers.

Like I said I like what you say because you speck with Knowlege, I really like Matts hounds there is No B.S. they are The two best B&T's I have ever seen go through the woods. He kid off got P.Oed with me because I made arrangements with Bill Mack to get at least one of them regestered. I just felt The B&T Bloodline would Benifit from his hounds. One of these days you may want to ask him about his run in with my hound LOL!!! I had the advantage he just drove 7 hours LOL!! He is a great young Buck and will do hound hunting Proud. I introduced him to one of My seniors MR. Upson I think they hit it off good. You are correct about blueticks,english and walker dogs were the same breed at one time. Something allot don't even want to talk about.

I have a question something that has been eating at me for a long time. I have herd of them through other Good houndmen. Good Redbones, I have only had four redbones None of them made the grade
But there has to be Good ones out there or they wouldn't have been bred this long. Do you Know of any bloodlines out there its just somthing I have to itch????

Great talking with you

Sarge

i forgot to mention spanky was the 1991 akc world champion too.

i had a female red bone many many years ago, dont remember what bloodline she had or if she even had one. she was blind in one eye and had been bred so many times you had to grease her teets to hunt her in the weeds and soy beans..big ol fog horn mouth. she was'nt gonna ambush any ,but she gave the true meaning to hound music.big long bawl track mouth and when she come treed you knew it. she sucked many hounds in that were turned loose to hunt miles away. main reason i started leashing my dog at the tree was because of that. if one come in i only had to deal with it. had a airdale come in to the tree one night,came in and jumped on her, i got it off her and it come at me. queenie seen it come back at her and she took off, so i had this ill dog on my dog off through the woods with me trying to catch up to help my old bitch.
time it was all said and done, it run me and queenie both back to, and in the truck..

your allot of help LOL!!!! you sound like an Old timer

I had a brush buster II female that was the very best I"ve had the pleasure to hunt with. She had the same kinda vioce TC was talking about. She also wasn't the loudest hound I hunted with but one heck of a hound. I never took her out without seeing the coon. JMO.

So where did that hound come from???

I had a old female. That had spanky and old. Northern blue jet 4, she could put a coon up at the end of bad track, she could drift tracks too. I miss the old girl.

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Live life like it your last day. Tell the ones you love how you feel. Ask for forgiveness when ever posible. (318) 576 3391 (home) (318) 228 5372 (cell) Love them Redbones

My hound came from Wis. but she originally came from Kevin Shirley. He lives in Kentucky, He has the sire and I believe a litter mate to my old girl.

I was talking about where the redbone came from, you are talking Blues my cup of tea Its an itch I have to scatch a breed I know nothing about when it comes to the good ones.