I have no experience with breeding. The only information I have is what I have read on this site in the last few days. I understand that the most important thing with breeding is that the breed needs to stay strong. I have read posts on this site about line breeding, cross breeding, and inbreeding. I must admit that because I don't "speak the language" it kind of gets confusing. So I would like to explain my situation and get some opinions from you guys here if my pups would help or hurt the name.

I have UKC redbones.

My gyp is going to be 3 in April. I bought her a year ago in Dec. I made the big rookie mistake of buying without seeing the dog in action or knowing the owners. Turns out that she is/was gun shy and worse terrified of coons. When I shoot her a coon down she will jump on it and make sure its dead but after she gets a good mouth full, she drops it and turns her back to it and kind of shakes. I can assume that at a young age she had a bad experience. This dog has great heart and loves to hunt and is fast on the track. She is trashy and loves to chase rabbits, fox, and opossum. We are making progress on breaking trash. When I hunt her with another dog I let her go after the first strike and she runs right in there and is usually the first to the tree. She stops barking when their is no more track, leaves to find another track, and is shortly back to running another track. She wants nothing to do with treeing.

I got my male in Nov. at 14 months old. I did hunt with this dog one night with his owner and a new dog that the owner got that day. The two dogs had treed at one of the drops and when we were headed in they left the tree and his new dog treed on another tree and my young dog did not and would not tree on that tree. We could not find a coon in that tree, I was pretty impressed that his dog was knocking down that tree and my dog said there was no coon in it. So I took him knowing that he would tree but wasn't pressured into a slick tree.
This dogs is/was scared or very timid of everything and everybody when I got him home. Had him a couple days and took him out with another dog and other people. He would not join in the hunt and was scared of the other dogs barking. When the coon hit the ground he jumped in and chomped on it even with the other dogs. So the rest of the season I hunted him solo. The first 5 weeks was very slow, most nights he would not even bark. (no coons or not used to me maybe?) The first coons that he started treeing were lay up. He was treeing with his nose in the air. The last few coons that he treed he had tracked but not with a lot of grace, but none the less he had the meat. I ran him with my gyp right before the nights got too cold and snowy, mid Jan. and right before my knee surgery, They ended up running trash together and ended up on a bad note. I have bought e-collars that will work out to 2 miles supposedly, but I haven't been able to get him out since. I feel that he also has the heart and loves coon hunting, but also needs some guidance that we are only hunting coons.

Now that you know the summed up pros and cons of these dogs lets talk about genetics.

GYP
sire=Hicks Rusty
degrees SC1
come from Wild Willie and Bombers Y2K-D

dam=Fource Maline Suzy
degrees 0
come from Hard Rock and Deep Fork Tsunami

not very impressive credits for the parents but very strong grandparents on top and ok on the bottom


Male
sire=Mc Millans Stonewall Rebel
degrees SC4 NC3
come from T-Top Tree Talkin Red Rat and T-Top Rock-N-Raven


Dam=Sterkis Famous Midnight Raven
degrees NC1
come from T-Top Rabble Rouser and Thomas Midnight Music

This dogs grandparents have very strong credits top and bottom

Both dogs have Hoffmeisters Rusty Red blood down the line which would make these dogs very very distant cousins.

So now it is time for the questions or concerns.

1. My male dogs shyness, is it something that would be considered a trait and would it show up in the pups. Is it something that you can only find out with breeding. (I would like to add that he is warming up and is very obedient to me and is wagging his tail more around other people but still gets scared around quick movements or noises.)

2. My female's lack of wanting to tree, not knowing her history and whether she was beat off a tree from another dog or attacked by a coon at the tree. Should she be culled for these reasons.

Both my dogs are well mannered, obedient, and have never shown any aggressive behavior other than killing opossum, or coons. They don't even bark at people coming in the house. The female greets with wagging tail and happy tongue, while the male hides behind the couch or desk. (yeah my dogs are considered one of the kids) Both dogs are friendly toward any other dog they have encountered and have never heard them growl.

Sorry for the long post, and being ignorant to breeding end of things but want to get some opinions as my gyp is in heat now and she will be hot in the next few days. I'll try to answer any questions I can.

Thanks,

Joel

Join the forum today and remove this ad!

I figured out how to get pictures on here...

This is my female

This is my male

Sounds like your dogs are only suffering from bad habits.... they may make a great cross and the pups would be more workable.

Sent from my ALCATEL_one_touch_988 using Ohub Campfire mobile app

Thanks for the reply.
I have been contacted by the owner of my gyp's mother and he has a couple of the siblings. He says that all of the siblings out of that litter are doing great and that mine is the only one that is having any issues.
I am not giving up on either of these dogs but I do believe it might be easier just to work with pups from the start now on.

I would say if ur goin to buy a dog and u want to hunt it before u but it don't let the guy take any other dog I did that when I first got in it I wanted a dog a guy had and he said come buy him at the tree so I went with him an he brought a old old dog to and I bought the dog I went for cause the coon was there and when it hit the ground he went crazy so I got him home a week later he had got use to me I took him out alone he never left my feet he was 4years old I took him every night for 2 months with my brother and no other dog and nothing he finally went Huntin and couldn't find ##*%* and I saw 7 coons that night that he ran past the tree they were in and even turned him loose on some tracks I saw on a creek bank moral to this story is the dog was great with other dogs but not alone so never take another dog on a trail hunt

But as far as breeding I'm not with most of these guys they say don't breed 2 trashy dogs cause u get trashy dogs I think it's all how u hunt the pups and train the pups those dogs u have more than likely weren't corrected when they went trashy so do what u do but don't lie to the people buyin the pups tell em what mom and dad do

Thanks Dodgeman

I had never thought about running the dog alone on the hunt. Good advise their. I have nothing to lie about. Everybody that I have asked to take me out with their dogs I tell them up front that my dogs have been or are trashy. I let them decide if they want to let me tag along. I sure would be mad if someone told me their dog was straight, knowing mine could be persuaded, they take off after trash.

I have decided to let them breed. I have been in contact with my gyp's mothers owner. He asked for one of the pups as he feels it will make a good cross. I also decided I want to start a dog knowing how it was raised. I was always against the puppy stage. My first hound was out of a shelter as a project dog. He turned out to be "one of those dogs" He would never win a hunt but he was accurate, always had the meat. The personality he had was second to none. May never find a hound that I will like more than him. RIP Chex dog. So decided that my next hound/s would be registered with good bloodlines, hoping to be able to comp hunt with them. Well obviously I am learning a lot about this sport and have a lot to learn in the future.

Appreciate the comments and suggestions

Joel

Joel, in my opinion, with you being all new to hounds and coon hunting, my opinion is there is no need to start breeding.


If you feel it would be easier to start with pups, my advise is to get a well bred pup out of proven crosses than try and breed your dogs and have puppies to get your pup to start.

I have said this time and time again, just cause folks have 2 dogs that can breed does not mean that they need to breed their dogs.

JRZ, let me ask you this - Do you feel that breeding your 2 dogs will better the breed?

_________________
CoonDawgs.com - A Site Designed for Coon Hunters
American Houndsmen - Vintage Hound Hunting
Coon Dog Cemetery - Key Underwood Coon Dog Memorial Graveyard
HuntingBassets.com - A site dedicated to hunting with Basset Hounds

Thanks for the reply Buckshot

To answer your question, yes.

Both these dogs have strong traits. She is fast and accurate with tracking, a loud mouth, and very smart with training commands. I have researched her littermates and mom as stated above. He is a heck of a treeing dog with a loud voice and can track the lay up coon mostly accurate. He really lacks in tracking on the ground and was improving every time out before the weather really turned up here. I have only had him a couple months while their has been snow and cold. He is bred 3/4 T-Top and have no reason to believe that he is not going to succeed after being worked with. He is a coon dog.

As with any cross you don't know until the pups show what they can do.

I gues I just can't understand a newby to the sport is so ready to jump in and start breeding and already feels his 2 dogs being bred will better the breed.

No offense, but you posted this thread 6 days ago and the first 2 sentences of the thread (quote below) makes me wonder why your breeding????? Also makes me wonder how you can feel that your breeding will better the breed. No offense, your posting on another forum asking feedback on your dogs littermates.To me, until you asked, you had no idea on how the crosses turned out, yet want to breed.

I am not trying to be ugly when I say this, but when you do not know too much about the lines your wanting to breed, then is breeding right at this point?



To each to their own - but that is just my opinion.

I am not taking offense.

The whole reason on posting is to get opinions and to learn. As I admitted right off the bat I know very little.

Thanks for replying

JRZ
Your dogs will probably get better with more woods time and some a strict training regimen to break off the trash...several years ago my uncle bought a walker named king. He wasn't worth 2 cents..he would go to the highest point on a hill and sit down and tree on the biggest tree. They bred him to a mean gyp dog that would attack a male dog that tried to breed her..they had to tie her to a tree for the breeding...my family hunted this cross until none of the descendants could be found. All my family swears this was the.best walker cross they had ever hunted with... you never know what a dog may really bring. If I had room I would take a pup from you to try...I have no experience with the redbones.
Thanks

Sent from my ALCATEL_one_touch_988 using Ohub Campfire mobile app

I've got to agree with Buckshot, there are WAY to many coonhounds being bred and WAY to many worthless pups being produced.

Based on your description both your dogs have serious temperment faults - shyness & gunshyness that may be genetic or may be man made. I also don't like the fact that she has no treeing desire/ability.

Breeding the two ISN'T going to improve the breed. No offense but based on your description many people and long time Redbone breeders would probably cull them not breed them.

What Mike said, a lot of guys have rose colored glasses, when it comes to there dogs, this leads to dogs being bred that should never be.

I would say the fact that your on here asking questions shows that you may have the intellect to some day be a breeder. However I garuntee if you hunt for another couple years you probably will have higher standards then what you do now. The best thing you could do, is get out there and hunt with as many other guys that you can. Eventually you will come across hound that will make quite an impression on you. Now when you have a hound that is better then that hound then I ya might want to think about breeding. Until then I would imagine all the training that goes into young dogs should keep you quite busy.

I am with Buck Shot on this. People are always breeding Handi to Ready. Have you ever heard 22, 22, 22. 22 months, 22 hunts, 22 shell. I use to live by that when I hunted black dogs, if they don't have it by then they never will. Another ? Would you want 12 pups like the sire and dam you are thinking about crossing. IMO I would not. GOOD LUCK WITH YOR BREEDING PROGRAM. We cross coon dog to coon dog with very few faults after 12 generation of breeding. Start your program with something similar and you will have a good foundation.

_________________
HAZEL HILL BLUETICKS -Carl Wilcox original owner
Home of Natural and Naturally Straight,Bawlmouth,Coldnose, Hardtreeing,Blueticks.
Hazel Hill Blueticks A Family Name since 1949.
Brad & Alison (Wilcox) McGill
(660) 833-3180