Threwout my life i have always heard the doctrin of once saved always saved, or eternal security. Although this would be a great thing to believe, that anyone could do whatever he/she wanted, and still go to heaven because they have been saved. What i have found in the bible, is totaly opposite from what i heard threwout my life. Lets go to the word of God for the answer. Note, im not putting my opinian in any of these verses, i believe the word of God can speak for itself.

Matt 10: 22- And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.

Matt 24:13- But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

Mark 7:20-23- And he said, that which cometh out of the man, that defileth the man. For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications. murders, Thefts, covetousnes, wickedness, decit, lasciviousness, foolishness: All these evil things come from within, and defile the man.

Luke 9:62- And Jesus said unto him, No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God.

Luke 13:24- Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, i say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able.

Rom 6:1-2 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

Rom 6:12-16 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, thatye should obey it in the lusts thereof. Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God. For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. What then? shall we sin,because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid. Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whetherof sin unto death or of obedience unto righteousness?

Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the spirit.

Rom 13:14 But put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make not provision for the flesh, to fulfill the lusts thereof.

1Cor 3:16-17 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

1Cor 6:9-10 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covvetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall ingerit the kingdom of God.

1Cor 9:27 But i keep under my body, and bring it into subjection:lest that by any means, when i have preached to others, i myself should be a castaway.

1Cor 15:1-2 Moreover, brethren , i declare unto you the gospel which i preached unto you, which also ye have recieved, and whrein ye stand; By which also ye are saved, IF ye keep in memory what i preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.

Eph 5:1-21 Be ye therefore followers of God, as dear children; And walk in love, as christ also hath loved us, and hath given himself for us an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweet-smelling savor. But fornication and ll uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints; Neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not conveient: but rather giving of thanks. For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience. Be not ye therefore partakers with them. For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light: For the fruit of the spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth; Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord. And have no fellowship with the unfruitfull works of darkness, but rather reprove them. For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret. But all things that are reproved are made manifest by the light: for whatsoever doth make manifest is light. Wherefore he saith, awakethou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ shall give thee light. See then that ye walk circumspectly, not as fools, but as wise, Redeeming the time, because the days are evil. Wherefore be ye not unwise, but as understanding what the will of the Lord is. And be not drunk with wine wherein is excess; but be filled with the spirit; speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord; Giving thanks always for all things unto God and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ; Submitting yourselves one to another in the fear of God.

2Thes 3:6 Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us.

1Tim 5:12-15 Having damnation, because they have cast off their first faith. And withal they learn to be idle, wandering about from house to house; and not only idle, but tattlers also and busybodies, speaking things which they ought not. I will therefore that the younger women marry, bear children, guide the house, give none occasion to the adversary to speak reproachfully. For some are already turned aside after Satan.

1Tim 6:11 But thou, O man of God, flee these things; and follow after righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, meekness.

Titus 1:15-16 Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled. They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

Titus 2:11-12 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world.

Heb 3:12-13 Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God. But exhort one another daily, while it is called Today; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.

Heb 12:15 Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled.

James 4:4 Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? Whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.

James 4:17 Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.

1Peter 1:13-17 Wherefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Jesus Christ; As obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance. But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation; Because it is written, Be ye Holy; for I Am Holy. And if ye call on the father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every mans work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear.

1Peter 2:1-3 WHEREFORE laying aside all malice, and all guile, and hypocrisies, and envies, and all evil speakings, As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby: If so be ye have tasted that the Lord is gracious.

1Peter 4:17-18 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God:and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God? And IF THE RIGHTEOUS SCARCELY BE SAVED, WHERE SHALL THE UNGODLY AND THE SINNER APPEAR?

2Peter 2:19-22 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage. For if after they have escaped the pollution of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning. For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them. But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, THE DOG IS TURNED TO HIS OWN VOMIT AGAIN; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

2Peter 3:17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own steadfastness.

1John 1:5-7 This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all. If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth. But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

1John 2:1 MY little children, these things write i unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have and advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous.

1John 2:3-6 And hereby we do know that we know him, IF we keep his commandments. He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him. He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.

1John 2:9-10 He that saith he is in the light, and hateth his brother, is in darkness even until now. He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.

1John 2:15-17 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If and man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world. And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.

1John 2:24 Let that therefore abide in you, which ye have heard from the beginning. IF that which ye have heard from the beginning shall remain in you, ye also shall continue in the Son, and in the Father.

1John 3:3 And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.

1John 3:7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

1John 3:15 Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.

1John 3:24 And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the spirit which he hath given us.

1John 5:4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

1John 5:18-19 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not. And we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness.

2John 1:9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.

Rev 2:5 Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else i will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent.

Rev 21:7-8 He that OVERCOMETH shall inherit all things; and i will be his God, and he shall be my son. But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers,and sorcerers, and idolaters, and ALL liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

Rev 22:19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.




There are many other passages and parables in the bible on this subject, but these are the basic scriptures that show the truth. My prayer is that when you read this, you will take note on what the scriptures say.

_________________
And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. 1Timothy 3:16.

(706)889-5083

Wrights Midnight Blue Kennels

Join the forum today and remove this ad!

I have always heard that same thing from people. Once saved always saved. I never believe it though, it didnt seem logical to me, even when I was of young age. All answers to lifes questions are in the bible and just dont take anybodys word as truth not even a pastors as solid truth as some people might. Not putting down pastors but they are men to and can be lead a stray and make mistakes as we all do. Just for an example,Usually after I watch a film or movie on a historical biblical event, Like that of the passion of the Christ, I look to the bible to see if the film makers got it right and most times they dont, just as they did in this movie the passion of the Christ. They leave important verses out of it. So i know midnightbluekennels thinking is right. Just go to the scriptures for the truth and study the word to get the truth and not just what someone tells you is truth. No verse says it better than this one does. Phillipians 2:12 "Wherefore,my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only,but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling".

_________________
"Knock'em out John, it won't be long", Jerry Clower

just what i thank, when u r saved ur, u live different, all the once saved always saved is only if ur saved when people SIN they look for somewere to put it out of mind and they put it there. not to say after u get saved u r not going to sin, it just weighs more when u r saved


every one falls(SIN), u show what kind of person ur by how fast u get up!!!

Then how many times you figure Christ has to die for you?

I know my lord died so I can have the gift of eternal life the thing you have to liik at is the saved part alot of people have an encounter with God but they dont identify with him in the cross you have to die to yourself and have him live through you when you do this you are saved and sealded to the end of redemption... Praise the Lord for such an awesome gift how much he must truly loves us

I hafto agree withmidnite blue here. I've seen a lot of what I call "self rightchious" folks who seem to think that they are holier than thou and somehow better. It's not easy to be a christian. Many Many folk's struggle with their conscience everyday(myself included). Even though I have accepted Jesus christ as my lord and savior I know I still have to work very hard to follow his path. Every one of us will be judged in the end and let us all pray for a merciful god.
One of the things I struggle with on a daily basis is the passing of my cousin and best friend. Some will tell us that those who commit siuicide will not get to heaven. I beleive that my cousin is one of gods children. Broken yes, but still in gods hands. I have to beleive that at the end he found some sort of redemption. I can only hope that when my time comes god will forgive me for not seeing the warning signs or being there for my cousin in his darkest hour. when he needed help the most. I raise up my eyes to the hills and seek help....

Sparky I have had to work through suicides close to me and all the guilt and self blame for not seeing and trying to prevent it.What you are feeling is natural. Keep these facts in mind though. 1 in 3 people contemplate suicide. Women are for times more likely to attempt suicide but men are 2 or 3 times more likely to suceed. It is a serious health problem just like any physical ailment. Like you I cannot see God commiting any one to hell because they died of any particular ailment. (my opinion) Don't make your life misserable with guilt over this. I am certain that wasn't why your cousin committed suicide. Rather turn it over to God and free yourself to do his will. My sympatties to you and your family.
Now to the main topic. In my Bible there are know "ifs" or "maybe's" in John 3:16. Know where in my Bible does it tell me I can be saved by my own works, only by grace. Yes hopefully I will store up rewards in Heaven as the Lord may see fit. If baptism is not final in salvation, what happens to a person who may die shortly after baptism? You guys are questioning a basic principle of our faith. Tread carefully and discern the truth of our Lord.
As to what kind of walk with the Lord others have that isn't to much my business. I can only pray for them and in some cases aproacch them as Paul instructs us. The one thing I can do a lot about is improving my walk with the Lord.
I was at a outreach last night that was so special. I hardly know many of the people who were there and yet their growth in the Lord was so great.We could discern each others thoughts and statemens as though we were brothers and sisters or spouse. Of course in the Lord we are!! Now to me that is the true Church!! Halleluia!!!!!!

These versus have been refered to as the "roman road".

Romans #:23 for all have sinnedand fall short of the glory of God

Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

John 3:3 Jesus answered and said to him, "truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."

John 14:6 Jesus said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father but through Me."

II Corinthians 5:15 and he died for all, that they who live should no longer live for themselves, but for Him who died and rose againon their behalf.

Revelation 3:20 "Behold, I stand at the door and knock; if anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him, and will dine with him, and he with me."

everything i have said is in the bible, and i dont care who you are, how long youve been going to church, or how old and knowledged you think you are, if you read this forum i have wrote and took right out of the king james versian bible, you cannot, i repeat, you cannot deny what these verses say, and what they are saying. The bible says that repentance means forsaking your sins. if you read what this forum says, there is no way you can deny it. of course we all know were this doctrin came from, it came from people that had truly repented and after awhile they let the devil get them off the right track and tricked them into saying well its just a little sin, but let me tell you something the bible says one time, God winked at ignorance but he will not do it again. just read this post, it is very simple to understand. God Bless You.

Well I just have to thank God right here for his patience with me! I know I'm always being dealt with to correct this or that in myself and I'm so glad He says in His word that if we repent He is faithful and just to forgive us. For all those who do struggle with sin just know you can come back to the Lord if you truly want to walk in His ways. You must be sincere but if you mess up and sin don't give up. It isn't too late until you leave this life. We are to live clean and godly lives and be a witness to others of God's goodness so admit what you are doing that isn't right, sincerely repent (stop it, turn the other way from it, don't do it again), and ask God's forgiveness.

_________________

Aman buddy, Jesus said if i be lifted up, i will draw all men unto me. theres power in the name of Jesus, but not just some power, Jesus said i have all power in heaven and in earth. He is all knowing, and all powerfull. but without his grace we will never make it, no matter how much we do. and ill leave you on this. The bible says if the rightious scarcly make it were will the sinners and ungodly appear.

Hey midknight, if you haven't deleted my e-mail to you I would appreciate it if you posted it on this forum. I guess I'll write another one regarding eternal security for the born again Christian if you have deleted it.

im not going to start an argument on this site, you can post what you want, and ill reply with an honest answer. but if you are going to post, lets make it an honorable debat.

John Newton was a captain of a slave ship when he was baptised and continued 10 years afterwad before the Lord made him aware that what he was doing was a sin! He later apologized to the Negro race for what he had done. He went on to become a minister and to write amazing grace! I guess it amazes me just how the Lord can work in each of our lives! When I study the laws of the old testament, I can assure you I have sinned since I was baptised and it weren't for the Grace of the Lord, I would be lost. Each day I strive for that "closer walk with Thee". When you read the 23 rd Psalm and it talks about the "vally of the shadow of death", well that is where we have been ever since we were expelled from the Garden of Edon. The path to Heaven is narrow!
Midnightblue I am definitly not trying to start a arguement with you in anyway and yes your verses quoted are accurate. However I don't believe anyone can have a perfect walk. If that were possible Jesus would not have had to pay the ultimate price for us. We are saved only by Grace, but by our works the Lord should be visible to others in our lives.

Mel

John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son that whosoever believed in him should not perish but have everlasting life. By Grace are ye saved, not of works lest any man should boast. Mans best works are as filthy rags in the eyes of God. Grace is unmerited favor. Grace cannot be bought or earned. Salvation is by Grace through Faith. The old Testament was the Law of God, of which no mortal man could keep. The New Testament is the Law of Love which Jesus gave to us. Jesus died once on the cross for all the sins of mankind til His return. When a person believes and trust Jusus as his savior, the Holy Spirit enters into his body and unites with his Soul (Spirit) and becomes Gods. The mortal man is carnal and sinful and his thoughts are carnal, but his Spirit is kept Clean and Holy and is kept HOLY because the HOLY SPIRIT dewells there in and God the Father, God the Son and God the HOLY Spirit are sinless and therefore the Saved soul is kept sinless as it is part of GOD. Man is sinful, so there fore your mind may sin and your body may do sinful things, but the Saved Soul belongs to GOD, it is no longer your ! I ask this question is GOD capable of sin? if your answer is no then theSaved Soul is of God and belongs to him. I hope this helps to clear this matter up for those who reads this.

_________________
Good Hunting to All & God Bless
Texascoonhunter