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B&T name change for AKC acceptance
Poll ended at Fri Aug 12, 2005 9:02 pm
I'm for it. 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
I'm against it. 84%  84%  [ 21 ]
Doesnt matter. 16%  16%  [ 4 ]
Total votes : 25
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 Post subject: B&T folks?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2005 9:02 pm 
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Chop Mouth
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How many on here support the name change from American Black and Tan Coonhound to American Black and Tan Trail and Tree Hound to apease the AKC?

I am against!!!!

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2005 9:23 pm 
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Steve Fielder called me right I posted the below message I posted on the AKC forum about the Kentucky State Event. Just say we did not have a freindly conversation about it.


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I do see a problem if AKC regular B&T's are able compete with the FSS B&T's. Seeing as how AKC wants to rename the hunting B&T's name.

It's really asinine to know that here is a Coon hunting event and AKC black dogs are coming to compete in the show against FSS B&t's that can't even have the name Black and Tan Coonhound.

Really ironic and absurd!!!!

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2005 9:53 pm 
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Chop Mouth
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that the B&T Stud books are closed. Under AKC rules the UKC B&T's cannot be accepted even under FSS. The UKC is not even an approved KC by AKC.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2005 10:04 pm 
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Here is some interesting reading:
Scroll down to The Emperor's New Coonhound: Is Your Parent Club Safe? and read the entries from there.

http://www.caninenewsblog.blogspot.com/


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2005 12:53 am 
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:shock: i dont like the changin of the name mine are american blackandtan coonhounds im not even interested in akc since they wont recognize them as the same that they are allready registerin :P


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2005 1:37 am 
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I don't like the idea at all. I will say in a thread on thier forum someone in the ACK B&T association said the members hadn't even voted on it yet. They haven't been shown the pros and cons. Also everyone I have seen either doesn't care either way or is against it. I guess just another thing AKC doesn't listen to its people on.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2005 8:26 am 
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I don't understand why anyone would have anything to do with AKC, all they are is a bunch of money hungry SOB's. And I'm not about to give them any of my money. Heck I dont even have a black dog on the place but I don't want to see there name changed, I just don't see a good reason for it. ( JMO )


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2005 9:04 am 
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what akc is doing seems to be consistent with big business in america these days. steve fielder has from the time he was at ukc tried to portray himself as just a good ol' boy who was looking out for us. i guess now big money has him showing his true colors. it reminds me of a story about honor and money. a young girl was asked by a rich old man if for a million dollars she would spend the nite with him. after some thought the girl said, "well that's alot of money so i will", then the old man asked if she'd be willing to spend the nite with him for 5 dollars and girl became indignant and said "what kind of girl do you think i am?! the old man just smiled and said we've already figured that out, now we're just negotiating the price.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2005 11:16 am 
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This is a quote from Steve Fielder explaining his feelings on this sublect. Read it all the way to the end. I can almost see his point. I wish B&T breedsers would go back to the old stock B&T's. Back when they were big, Huge-mouthed,long eared, and cold-trailers. I know people are breeding them to to be faster where they can keep up with the Walkers and Blueticks, but i personally loved the way my granddads Old B&T's hunted.

Of course most of you know how i stand on showdogs; If they dont hunt, cull 'em and save your dog feed money!!!!!!!!
but anyway here's Steve's quote.......



"The more I am around these AKC dogs the more the point becomes abundantly clear - they are different in many ways from the UKC Black and Tans!

These breeders are largely breeding down from a Robert St. John-bred hound named Adjin (sp?). As I recall, a few years ago a Dr. Robert Porter in Alabama was active in Black and Tans had had some of this blood in his UKC hounds. Correct me if I'm wrong. Robert St. John was from northern Tennessee, along the Kentucky border and had this stud dog. Essentially the successful bloodlines of today in this breed came down from two sons of this hound. I got this information from Neal Emmons, an AKC breeder and judge from Norwood, Georgia. These dogs go back to the Maple Valley dogs of Greencastle, IN.

These folks are trying to preserve the original, long-eared Black and Tan. The problem is that very few of them actually hunt the dogs any more. This was the Black and Tan in the days before Hans Wagner, Floyd Teegarden, Uncle Jimmie Hulme, Col. Joe Bloodworth, Lee Eads, or any of the other successful "medium-eared" B/T breeders that were the forerunners of today's B/T breeders came along. These old-fashioned dogs were nearly bred out of existence and I applaud the efforts of these breeders to preserve these dogs in their original form. Of course I wish they had kept hunting them.

I'm sure all the breeds were affected by the early field trials and the nite hunts that followed and the early success of the Walkers. Everyone wanted to build a hound that was extremely fleet of foot and bred that way, away from the larger, shorter-legged, long-eared hounds that were the staple of the early pioneers and most coonhunters in the first third to half of the 20th century.

Do you see why these folks want to preserve these grand dogs as they were 100 years ago? They are beautiful animals. I would like to see some serious hunters seek out puppies from these dogs and put them through a serious training effort and bring the instincts back to the surface. The problem is that these dogs are not going to be the race-horse, quick-tree dogs that the nite hunts require. But I'll venture that as hunting territory decreases to more controlled environments in years to come, that these hounds, provided their hunting abilities are enhanced, could be popular again.

You see, if the tsumami of modern B/T blood comes in like a flood, these grand old dogs will fade away. The AKC people love their breed and of course never want to see that happen. I have to say that I agree.

Do I hunt this type of dog? No. Do I think they should be preserved? Absolutely. They are a very important part of the history of hunting with hounds in this country. We just need to find breeders that are not only enamored with their beauty but also with their ability to track and tree raccoons for which they were originally bred.
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2005 12:04 pm 
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Hog wash Look at any other hunting breed or pointing or even retriever in AKC. They have thier show dogs and then thier trial dogs. The owners and breeders know the difference. For instance I own beagles also I know the difference between a show beagle and a hunting beagle. 2 totally different dogs in the same manner as B&T's. All that is is trying to get someone to see AKC's way by haveing a pitty party for the old fashioned B&T's. If those people love those dogs so much they bwill not die out or whatever. That is the biggest crock of well never mind getting a little agitated at AKC and its load of bull on every subject.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2005 1:25 pm 
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Loose Mouth
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I think I will keep my money in my pocket .. Im against most things that AKC stands for.. and the way I see it.. all this including hounds has done is increase their cash flow.. count me and my hounds out.. if they are not going to have the same rights as the rest of the other dogs.. then they arent gonna get my money.. I do believe they tried this before about 9 years ago.... and it flopped then.. JMO

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2005 3:38 pm 
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Hey you tell em Girl. :lol: Tell em I said so too!! :wink:


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2005 6:02 pm 
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the "new" name Sounds like some politically correct crap to me. It's a coonhound, get over it.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2005 11:24 am 
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Loose Mouth
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Hey Bub... Im not only against the name change.. Im against AKC all together.. the name change is minor compared to what they are doing with the PAWS bill... check it out.. and see if you still feel the same way about AKC.. If you do.. your not much of a hound hunter.. cuz they are against that.. They are hand and hand with PETA.. so check it out.. then let us all know how you feel.. its more then just a name change that has me up in the air!! Susie


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 31, 2005 3:30 pm 
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Mr. Possum, we have seen eye to eye this time. If people see it OK to cross with the old style Black & Tans, they will be bred out of existence. A total shame. Some people still breed the hunt in these dogs, and they are awesome cold trailers. I see your point with the show folks, but I don't even want to get started (slow typer). These types should be kept apart----strictly.


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